Post by Admin on May 28, 2019 9:47:16 GMT
Hi all!
After a wonderful weekend event together we ended with a philosophy panel that feels like it left people a bit confused. Therefore, I'd like to clarify my view on 'what is what', and how the different parts of what we're doing is possibly connected.
VISION MEETING vs PHILOSOPHICAL DISCUSSION
The way I see it is that visions - at least the way they are formulated right now - are fairly straight forward. It seems like the emphasis is on building things that will make the place better suited for having a good time together: Making a big outdoor grill/barbeque, a sauna, facilitating the possibility of swimming in the lake, an outdoor shower etc ... Doing these things seems straight forward and is more a matter of when to do it, and amassing the people to make it happen.
What we tried to open up in the philosophy/theology discussion on the other hand is somewhat different. I think to some extent we share implicit notions of what is important for us. And I agree with Helena who said (at the start-up meeting) that I believe in the organic growth of the community to see what it is and can become. Discussing philosophy and theology has been an important part of previous years' events, and has invited people to think of more or new aspects of being together than they might have heretofore. What I don't see the philosophy/theology discussions as, however, is trying to decide on a straight path forward or aiming at consensus.
The way I formulated it in the Sunday session was that I believe that we, as humans, are both strangers to each other but also to our selves. By addressing and bringing up different things in a climate of open discussion is one of many ways that I believe we can show ourselves to each other. To say 'this is where I am, on my journey - what about you guys?'.
Megan Devine has this little video on how to support someone in grief that I think is very helpful and very beautiful in its simplicity:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2zLCCRT-nE
In it there is a beautiful quote by someone named Parker Palmer, saying:
"The human soul doesn't want to be adviced or fixed or saved. It simply wants to be witnessed, exactly as it is."
I think that witnessing of what is in each others' hearts and minds in something that can take a lot of different expressions. Expressing your inner philosophical, theological or other convictions is one of them.
The aim of the discussion was not to arrive at anything, but an open exchange of ideas. And I certainly hope that neither one of you took it as some kind of 'Simon and Jonatan thinks that everyone should agree on these principles'.
This is one way of seeing each other and being seen. Opening up avenues of agreement and disagreement. Hopefully building a community that can handle both things productively.
For me personally, christian mysticism underwrites what I do, who I am and what I can gift to you all. That is not to say that everyone must agree or understand where my efforts are coming from. Much like I wont always understand where others get their inspiration.
I think it's extremely interesting that we can do deeply religious practices like Kundalini Yoga. We really are knee deep in religious practices. At the same time I have a hunch that many people would be very hesitant to join a 'try out Christian prayer' workshop, or if they joined, the would do so feeling fairly uncomfortable. (I could be wrong pf course, you guys are a remarkably open bunch of people.) This is not a critique towards Kundalini Yoga. Quite the opposite. It’s a hope that we can be daring enough to explore religious practices, regardless of their heritage.
Personally, I am very critical to a lot of aspects of Christianity, and I don't know of any church that 'does' Christianity in the way I believe it to be powerful and transformative. For me, the Teologen live set, is maybe the primary way to explore what is totally vacant from all sites of Christian faiths I know of; dancing to repetitive music (to reach an altered state of consciousness) as one of the foremost spiritual practices I am aware of (and after 12 years of University studying world religions, Islam, Christian Theology etc I am aware of A LOT of spiritual practices).
Maybe this preface or distinction would've been needed before the philosophy discussion got going, but at least now, I get to express how I view the difference between visions and philosophy. But also the importance of both.
I think this it’s fascinating how this community of ours is inhabited by such diverse individuals: yogis, djs, meditators, a psychedelicly inclined catholic, a technoproducing theologian, psychologists, many who have a totem animal (or several!), councellors, philosophers, ppl who have went on drum journeys, animal whisperers, jungians, dancers, and people who feel that both religion and atheism leave us wanting for ... something. I for one, love to explore these connections deeper and more with you in the future!
Love and respect to you all
/Jonatan
After a wonderful weekend event together we ended with a philosophy panel that feels like it left people a bit confused. Therefore, I'd like to clarify my view on 'what is what', and how the different parts of what we're doing is possibly connected.
VISION MEETING vs PHILOSOPHICAL DISCUSSION
The way I see it is that visions - at least the way they are formulated right now - are fairly straight forward. It seems like the emphasis is on building things that will make the place better suited for having a good time together: Making a big outdoor grill/barbeque, a sauna, facilitating the possibility of swimming in the lake, an outdoor shower etc ... Doing these things seems straight forward and is more a matter of when to do it, and amassing the people to make it happen.
What we tried to open up in the philosophy/theology discussion on the other hand is somewhat different. I think to some extent we share implicit notions of what is important for us. And I agree with Helena who said (at the start-up meeting) that I believe in the organic growth of the community to see what it is and can become. Discussing philosophy and theology has been an important part of previous years' events, and has invited people to think of more or new aspects of being together than they might have heretofore. What I don't see the philosophy/theology discussions as, however, is trying to decide on a straight path forward or aiming at consensus.
The way I formulated it in the Sunday session was that I believe that we, as humans, are both strangers to each other but also to our selves. By addressing and bringing up different things in a climate of open discussion is one of many ways that I believe we can show ourselves to each other. To say 'this is where I am, on my journey - what about you guys?'.
Megan Devine has this little video on how to support someone in grief that I think is very helpful and very beautiful in its simplicity:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2zLCCRT-nE
In it there is a beautiful quote by someone named Parker Palmer, saying:
"The human soul doesn't want to be adviced or fixed or saved. It simply wants to be witnessed, exactly as it is."
I think that witnessing of what is in each others' hearts and minds in something that can take a lot of different expressions. Expressing your inner philosophical, theological or other convictions is one of them.
The aim of the discussion was not to arrive at anything, but an open exchange of ideas. And I certainly hope that neither one of you took it as some kind of 'Simon and Jonatan thinks that everyone should agree on these principles'.
This is one way of seeing each other and being seen. Opening up avenues of agreement and disagreement. Hopefully building a community that can handle both things productively.
For me personally, christian mysticism underwrites what I do, who I am and what I can gift to you all. That is not to say that everyone must agree or understand where my efforts are coming from. Much like I wont always understand where others get their inspiration.
I think it's extremely interesting that we can do deeply religious practices like Kundalini Yoga. We really are knee deep in religious practices. At the same time I have a hunch that many people would be very hesitant to join a 'try out Christian prayer' workshop, or if they joined, the would do so feeling fairly uncomfortable. (I could be wrong pf course, you guys are a remarkably open bunch of people.) This is not a critique towards Kundalini Yoga. Quite the opposite. It’s a hope that we can be daring enough to explore religious practices, regardless of their heritage.
Personally, I am very critical to a lot of aspects of Christianity, and I don't know of any church that 'does' Christianity in the way I believe it to be powerful and transformative. For me, the Teologen live set, is maybe the primary way to explore what is totally vacant from all sites of Christian faiths I know of; dancing to repetitive music (to reach an altered state of consciousness) as one of the foremost spiritual practices I am aware of (and after 12 years of University studying world religions, Islam, Christian Theology etc I am aware of A LOT of spiritual practices).
Maybe this preface or distinction would've been needed before the philosophy discussion got going, but at least now, I get to express how I view the difference between visions and philosophy. But also the importance of both.
I think this it’s fascinating how this community of ours is inhabited by such diverse individuals: yogis, djs, meditators, a psychedelicly inclined catholic, a technoproducing theologian, psychologists, many who have a totem animal (or several!), councellors, philosophers, ppl who have went on drum journeys, animal whisperers, jungians, dancers, and people who feel that both religion and atheism leave us wanting for ... something. I for one, love to explore these connections deeper and more with you in the future!
Love and respect to you all
/Jonatan